International Award to Recognise Human-Centred AI Innovation in Social Work and Social Development

[00:00:03] Well, welcome back to The Social World Podcast. Sorry, it's been a while, but circumstances have got in the way, but we're back with a bang and a fantastic story for you today and a fantastic guest with some exciting new developments in social work. So we have Dr. Marina Badillo-Diaz. Welcome. I mean, I'm going to tell a little bit about you, Marina, but just hello first.

[00:00:33] Yes. Thank you so much, David, for having me on the podcast. Oh, you're very welcome. Now, you're actually a social worker. You did your, you also did the social work at New York University, the doctorate, and then you got a master's at Columbia. Is that right? Yes, that's correct.

[00:00:53] And you also are the chief executive of MABD Consulting and the AI social worker, which will be much more relevant to what we're going to talk about as well. And at the AI social worker, people can have a look at more detail about what you do. Anyway, listen, very welcome to you because you are essentially what we're going to be talking about today, which is AI and social work and the future. So glad to have you along.

[00:01:24] Let's say just a little bit about what you do first, about what the company does and so on, before we get to the big announcement. Could you just give us a bit of a resume about what your work is and what kind of things you get involved with? Thanks, David. So yeah, so my brand, the AI social worker, is really meant to provide information for social workers and how to integrate AI into their practice ethically and responsibly.

[00:01:53] So I have my website where I have a lot of free resources, a guidebook, prompt library, different templates for how to integrate AI and supervision and building AI policy for nonprofits. And so that's part of the work that I do is just sharing a lot of information and knowledge with the profession.

[00:02:13] And I also do training. So I've had the fortunate and privilege to be able to train thousands of social workers across the U.S., Canada, and even globally, where I've done trainings for and talks with social workers in Southeast Asia and South Africa.

[00:02:31] And this work is just growing. And it's been really exciting to be in this space in community with other social workers, really grappling with this technology and wanting to better understand what it is in AI literacy, while also integrating and reckoning with some of these ethical considerations and risk management strategies too. Fine. Unbelievable. I've used this joke with you before, but I wonder what you do in the afternoons, you know.

[00:03:00] It's such a busy schedule, but you do enjoy it. I remember talking to you about it and how committed you are to the subject. Yes. And with that too, I just want to also share that I do teach in higher ed. So I am developing courses for social work students in the master's level and at different universities where I'm teaching AI and social work.

[00:03:27] And also at the postgraduate level as well, too, doing different certificate programs. And with that, another piece of my business is also training social work professors on AI and integrating into the classroom and then learning from the trends of what's happening in the field so we could better prepare students in using this technology for their future in the profession. No, that was really helpful. No, that was really helpful run through just to give people a background about what depth of experience you've got.

[00:03:55] So it's really good that what we're going to be talking about. But just one thing, because we've got an international audience, as you know, and you're based in New York. But I do know that you travel the world extensively doing all the various things, lecturing and educating that you've talked about. But most of what you talk about, would you say, are transferable information and education internationally? Absolutely.

[00:04:22] You know, I know there's variations of our profession and people's roles and, of course, the cultural context and the work that we do as social workers globally. But I do think that AI and AI literacy is certainly going to transfer across the globe as we're all sort of reckoning with this technology and how to integrate it to practice and how it could provide potentially opportunities, but then also some real ethical concerns too. Okay. Right.

[00:04:51] Well, having set the scene, I think we should just now announce the fact that we're about to launch, well, we have launched. Actually, a competition, a worldwide competition that I'm relying a lot on you, Marina, to explain a bit more about. But it's an innovation in social work and social development with human centered AI award.

[00:05:17] And that was promoted by Professor Tiong at the University of Singapore, who is the chair of the Global Institute of Social Work, who have been the driving force, if you'd like, behind this. And they've pulled together different organizations worldwide, whether it's the International Federation of Social Workers, ICSW, ICSD, and Commonwealth Organization of Social Work.

[00:05:45] So, apart from this podcast, Social World Today, and the magazine in the UK, Social Work Today, which will be hopefully promoting this. So, Marina, do you want to just give us a bit of an insight about how you responded to the news about this? And now that you're involved also in the committees and stuff like that, helping structure it. What's the feeling been?

[00:06:13] For me, it's definitely excitement. I think excitement to showcase and also learn from other social workers around the globe who are engaging in innovative ideas around AI and using it as a solution to provide some type of, you know, whether it be community, clinical, educational, and even administrative sort of implementation of using this technology.

[00:06:41] You know, as social workers, we are in so many different aspects of whether it be, you know, human sort of disasters or crisis response or that clinical sort of mental health aspect or working in hospitals. I think there's a real opportunity for this technology to provide intervention. And so this award is really showcasing a social worker who's doing, in fact, that very work and actually producing some outcomes as well.

[00:07:09] I mean, in your work and your travels promoting that work, I mean, I was led to understand from you that actually AI and social work innovations or practice has been going on for quite a while now. And I think that's probably why you and others decided that this competition is open to projects that have actually been going for nine months already.

[00:07:37] But that should not diminish the field at all from what you're saying in terms of the quite considerable amount of work that's going on worldwide. Is that fair? I believe so, because as you mentioned, there's already been social workers in this space. And artificial intelligence isn't a new technology. This technology has been around for decades. I think what's happening, especially in the past few years, is the accessibility of these generative AI tools.

[00:08:05] And now we're building agents. Now we have Angetic AI, which is a lot more accessible now to the public and to research institutions and to social workers who can now utilize this technology for good. That's my hope, right, is that we're using this for good to really empower communities and provide opportunities for accessibility and interventions to really make an impact.

[00:08:57] Yeah. I want to say, too, that this is a free competition. People can enter it for nothing. All the details will be on the GISW, the Global Institute for Social Work website, which I'll give you all the details in the text of this podcast. But secondly, there's a cash prize because people recognize the time and effort that has to be put into that and the need to extra recognize, if you like, the winners.

[00:09:27] So there'll be $5,000 for the first prize, $3,000 for the second and $2,000 for the third. So a total of $10,000 committed to supporting people and supporting the winners of this brilliant competition. Anyway, how would you respond now, do you think? Do you think that there will be quite a take up of this? I hope so.

[00:09:51] And, you know, our intention certainly through this podcast, through the networks of folks that are on the committees, that we will be sharing this with a wide cast net, right, to get as many folks aware of this award, nominate folks for this award, or even self-nominate if you're someone who's doing this type of work in your community to really showcase how this technology is really impacting.

[00:10:16] We have a couple categories that we're looking for applications of demonstrating that area of AI and integration. So one is certainly around casework, clinical practice, and mental health.

[00:10:33] And I certainly know there's projects that are really diving into how can we use AI to provide accessibility for clients to have access or just even folks in communities that have access to some type of mental health support. And there's also another category of social development and community intervention as well, too.

[00:10:56] So how can we use this technology to support communities and community intervention, whether it be risk management, crisis support, even looking at communities around health care and health care access with artificial intelligence. And then there's also another category of policy, service, administration, and advocacy.

[00:11:14] Obviously, I know very well in the States that a lot of some of our social work chapters and organizations are working side by side with legislators to build policy around artificial intelligence for safety, for the community safety of vulnerable folks. But then also holding companies around the environmental aspects of artificial intelligence.

[00:11:40] So another category is around policy and service and admin and advocacy, where our category is education, research, and training. So how AI is being used to being integrated in higher education institutions, teaching of students, using AI platforms to help teach and train students, building courses and research around artificial intelligence and the profession, and of course, training as well, too. So there's a number of different categories.

[00:12:10] And we hope that because we have larger categories, too, that will also allow for more applicants also. Yeah. Yeah. Well, also, I mean, because I've been reading a lot of the work that's come out of the committees when they've been constructing this award, and they want to suggest that it's assessed primarily on impact, ethics, and scalability. And I think that sort of covers it, unless you want to add some more to that.

[00:12:40] But the impact of their work, the ethical background to their work, which they've got to evidence, and scalability, which obviously will be of interest to organizational structures. I agree, David.

[00:13:24] But I think that's a good thing. You know, the bottom line is, ultimately, certainly primarily, apart from the people whose social workers are working for and working with, but it's for the training of social workers themselves. I think ultimately this is very important.

[00:13:44] And I've got to say the Global Institute of Social Work, of which I'm a proud member of the International Advisory Panel, believe in the use of AI for good. And their mission is to make social work training accessible for effective practice, especially for those that need it most.

[00:14:06] And I really recommend people to go and have a look at the Global Institute of Social Workers website and just see what they've managed to do. Right. Now, can I say something? Can I quote something to you, Marina, and see how you'd like to expand on this?

[00:14:25] It's Tiong, Professor Tan, the professor of social work at Singapore University, who's the chair of the Global Institute of Social Work, gave me some questions that he would have liked to sort of put answers and talked about. But he can't unfortunately make this podcast, but I'm sure we'll have another one. And he said, what are the goals and the purposes for launching this award?

[00:14:48] So, and he's put to recognize, support and disseminate human-centered AI innovations that align with professional social work and social development values and human rights standards. So they got quite a lot into that small paragraph, but I think that shows the care that's been taken here to look at the criteria. Would you agree with that?

[00:15:12] Absolutely. There was definitely an intentional process for the committee to develop the criteria for this award, and that wasn't done lightly. There were certainly iterations, different voices really wanting to capture the essence of what we wanted this award to stand on.

[00:15:36] And so even there's some areas within the award that, in the application process, that if someone is nominating or, you know, nominating themselves, there has to be detailed responses talking about how the project challenges exclusion, inequity, power misuse, because there isn't a social justice advancement aspect.

[00:15:58] The environmental footprint. So looking at the ecological impact, sustainability considerations, because we know as social workers, that's one of our core values as well. Community co-design. So how was the community in design, the problem definition evaluating from its inception? You know, how was the community a part of the project and informed consent protocols?

[00:16:23] Of course, that's just falls in line with ethics, how was obtained, but also just around AI transparency and human agencies, how people were informed about the AI capacities, options for human review and opting out, and the safeguarding for vulnerable groups.

[00:16:42] And I think for us, that was really important as well, because as social workers, we really want to ensure how does this AI implementation still at the same time protects children, individuals, potential disabilities, marginalized users, and adverse impact monitoring. So that was really in line with our professional values. I do. I mean, I remember as the last month or two have gone by talking to yourself and others and, you know, how it's going.

[00:17:12] I mean, some people might think it was micromanaged, but I think it was well managed, to be honest with you, because ultimately we deal in social work with incredible sensitivities from a whole variety of different groups and angles.

[00:17:30] And so that the practitioners who will have, as you said, social justice in the background, but also human dignity, self-determination, and we're going to make sure that there's informed consent built in to any projects. Does that add to your, that adds to the list, doesn't it, of what you've all worked out? Yes, yes.

[00:17:56] But that's essentially it. And those are the evaluation criteria is that applications will be evaluated across five core criteria, which is demonstrating social impact and practical application, ethical integration, that social justice, environmental responsibility as well, too. So that's category two or criteria number two, and then participatory co-design.

[00:18:20] And number four, accessibility equity. And then number five, which is governance, human oversight and sustainability. Well, I think we can also say that as well as the prize money that we're offering, they will be invited to participate. The winners will be invited to participate in making a podcast with myself. I mean, I'm sure that's worth millions of dollars, but never mind.

[00:18:47] I'm quite happy to put that into the pot, but I just think it's just so exciting, the whole thing. So I don't care. I mean, I just want to actually learn from all the projects that get put forward and all the innovatory ideas. How will this, you travel quite a lot internationally and you've mentioned several countries to me that you've seen AI projects actually to do with social work continuing and blossoming.

[00:19:15] Can you say a little bit about that, just generally speaking? Yeah. So, I mean, certainly I know I come from the United States and so we've certainly had some research on artificial intelligence and AI chatbots. I'm thinking of a colleague of mine, Dr. Shadi Saba, who's been doing that work. I know there's also publications and articles coming out of New Zealand as well, really looking at ethical considerations of the use of artificial intelligence.

[00:19:45] I know even out of Hong Kong, there's been research by social workers looking at using AI to even support and address loneliness with the elderly population. Yeah. So there's been really unique ways of just this, you know, this technology.

[00:20:05] I'm even thinking of a study coming out of, I believe it is out of Australia, looking in higher education, how to use AI chatbots and chat to BT and perplexity to just deepen student learning in the classroom by teaching how to prompt and also reflecting on the cases that are being discussed with the AI chatbot. So there's been some really interesting projects happening around globally.

[00:20:29] And so I'm really excited for this award to really showcase that and from a global perspective as well. No, no, I mean, I remember, I mean, safe houses were something that I remember from decades ago, people talking about. And that has happened because technology is kind of advanced a bit, but AI will really take that to a different level.

[00:20:55] You know, if you think about vulnerable people being able to stay in their own home longer because of AI powered technology, you know, whether it's making sure that they're safer, whether they get the health or their medicine that they need, whether the visits are there, whether they can actually talk to anybody when they want to and actually find an easy way that they can understand to actually communicate and share online. I mean, safe houses, it's just it's not a future thing anymore.

[00:21:25] They're here, aren't they? Right. They are. You're absolutely right. And now they're trying to build, you know, smart cities and smart technology, which essentially is artificial intelligence. Right. So, like you said, the future is now now here. And I fully believe that as social workers, that we that we should be a part of that and having a seat at the table, whether it be design, implementation, governance, legislation, policy.

[00:21:53] We certainly have a skill set that we could really offer for the betterment of this technology in society. I wish that I mean, I know that I found out quite to my pleasant surprise that the British Association of Social Workers actually does have an AI policy in place already. I'm not sure that very many social work associations around the globe have. I haven't done a poll, so perhaps I'm wrong, but I don't think so.

[00:22:20] And I hope that this spurs that at the very least, you know, professional bodies to look into it. But, you know, I mean, generally speaking, it's going to be something that is going to be challenged as well. I think we've got to tackle the elephant in the room here. And the fact that many or some or many, I don't know, social workers will have a great deal of caution about this.

[00:22:49] You know, thinking all the kind of problematic things that they might well have heard or experienced in their own lives when they try to use AI or heard about it in other fields. Do you think this can be a reassuring exercise as well as anything else?

[00:23:07] I think so. I mean, I agree with you that there are certainly social workers in our profession who are skeptical about this technology, who have a lot of concerns about this technology and understandably so. Right. There's there's concerns around bias. There's concerns around the environmental impact. There's concerns around, you know, just how these tools can simply just make up information.

[00:23:31] There's the vulnerable aspect of of youth and deep fakes pornography because of this technology. And, you know, I think as social workers, we're sort of grappling with understanding how this is going to be potentially negatively impacting our society. And at the same time, like this is where the dialectic is so true that even though, yes, those harms are occurring.

[00:23:53] And at the same time, there have been real opportunities for positive impact in in working in communities with vulnerable populations and increasing access and teaching, training and learning and and interventions to support with mental health. So I think both are are seemingly true right now in the work that we're doing. So, I mean, I mean, back to the question I had or the statement I had about not being able to put the genie back in the bottle.

[00:24:22] I mean, A.I. is here. You know, there's there's no kill switch at the moment that anybody's invented that was, you know, is recognizable or helpful. And we know that all the good that it can do needs to be harnessed as much as possible. And the world of social work is so eclectic. So to cover so many different parts of social living that it just makes such good common sense. I really hope, though, that we can persuade.

[00:24:52] Those who have great concerns is all the way along in history. I mean, I remember when I was managing social workers decades ago and women, individuals in my team, you know, single women were going out late night visits with, you know, just some coins for a phone box if necessary. And somebody then said to me, well, they've invented something called a mobile telephone.

[00:25:21] And I remember saying, well, let's get one, for God's sake, because safety, you know, et cetera, et cetera. It's a really, you know, sounds like a terrific invention. And so we sent over to another part of the authority to get it. And they came back with something that looked straight out of mash. This poor woman had to wear a huge backpack with a huge aerial. And it was like she was in the army. Yeah. But the subject was broached, if you say what I mean. The actual changes had begun.

[00:25:51] And thankfully, now social workers actually, from a point of view of communication and safety, can benefit from sort of mobile phones and so forth. But that's just a small thing. But life moves on is what I'm trying to say. And, you know, you can't control everything. So you've got to try and manage it. Well, and I really appreciate your point about the visits, right? The safety visits and pieces of that.

[00:26:16] And even just now in the current context of artificial intelligence, I know there are universities who are using artificial intelligence to help train students to do in-home visits. Because they're using virtual reality. Using artificial intelligence. And so students are practicing in the classroom using VR to then train in how to do a home visit. And then I also know of another research study looking at artificial intelligence and home visits and hoarding.

[00:26:45] And so using this technology that the person doesn't necessarily go or the social worker doesn't have to go necessarily in the home for the dike. Or using this technology when they go home with the diagnosis that they're using AI to help assess the level and amount of hoarding as well, too. So it's just interesting now sort of how this technology is being used in different ways, in different innovative and creative ways as well, whether it be on the teaching side or even intervention side. Oh, no.

[00:27:12] I mean, listen, you're preaching to the converted here. I do think, too, that over the last few years, especially during COVID especially as well, I was called upon to do lots of media stuff because of the sad news of children being killed, mainly by their parents.

[00:27:33] And when the reviews came out, you know, and it talked about people not getting access because COVID was used as an excuse, not getting access because people didn't know that they could get somebody else who had authority to go and see the child and so on and so forth. I think AI will produce monitoring services for children at higher risk. I mean, I know that a lot of people will say, hang about, hang about.

[00:28:03] This is Big Brother all over again. Well, to some extent, but Big Brother can be programmed to only look after those little brothers and little sisters that effectively need it so much. I just think, you know, there's going to be benefits here. And I hope to heck that it can stop on the safeguarding side some of the needless child deaths that occur. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:28:31] No, I think we're, and this is sort of why, again, I go back to why social work is certainly needed in this conversation. And we need an award like this to really showcase the work that is being done in our field with this technology. Closing date is the 31st of December. So I would encourage people to look into it quickly and effectively, you know, see what they have to do.

[00:29:00] And secondly, then in February, there'll be kind of the final coming together. And I think March, and I think it's probably going to be International Social Work Day that the awards might be actually presented. And I'll be more than happy to do interviews at that point. Marina, though, we're unfortunately having to come to the end of this particular session. Is there anything else that you would like people to be aware of?

[00:29:25] Well, I'm going to do plenty more of these podcasts to deal with this competition because I do believe in it strongly. So I'm sure Marina will be back in the not too distant future if she can stand it. But for now, Marina, would you like to sort of sign off with a sort of a sentence or two about anything else that's occurred to you?

[00:29:45] No, I just I really, truly look forward to the submissions of the competition, learning more and really uplifting and showcasing the great work that social workers are doing in this arena. So thank you for having me, David. Oh, you're so welcome. And will you come back again? Absolutely. Just tell me when we'll schedule another time. I just want witnesses. I just want witnesses. Yes. Oh, it's really good.

[00:30:10] So look, let's close this for just now and I'll just say cheerio offline for a sec, OK? But look, for the moment, I'm just so pleased in the fact that we managed to get this actually working. So where are we?